All right. Well, I think it's time ladies to get started. So, hi, everyone. My name is Tanya Mishra. I am a technologist by training and founder and CEO of a frontier tech training and placement organization called Sure Start.And I'm so delighted to be here on this panel today. Um Today, my amazing co Panelist, Alison Shamir, Gabby Cavallero and Bina Ramaswamy. And I will be discussing this really important topic of imposter syndrome and specifically how it manifests itself um among technologists, female technologists and how we can overcome it. Uh What are some tips, tricks and mindsets that can help us overcome um imposter syndrome which often holds us back.

Um So to get started, I will share my definition of impostor sy syndrome and then invite my co panelists to introduce themselves and also share their definition. And from there, we'll jump right into questions and stories and conversation and tips and advice. Um So my definition of imposter syndrome is, is doubting one's own abilities in spite of strong evidence to the contrary, feeling like a fraud, like we pulled a fast one on people around us and um not deserving of the recognition accolades or benefits from the work that we are doing and the context in which we are experiencing this imposter syndrome.

So, with that, I will hand the conversation over to Alison and Alison. Um You know, why don't you share your definition of um imposter syndrome? Uh But before that, please share about yourself and what brings you to this conversation?

Well, thank you Tanya and I think your uh definition was done beautifully. So I'm certainly just going to dovetail off that. But hello, everyone. I'm Alison. Shame. I'm an imposter syndrome, expert coach and speaker. I'm based in Sydney Australia, but I do work globally and travel, go globally and today I'm coming live from New York. So it's great to be back in the US in terms of my definition of imposter syndrome. So, what it essentially is is when you don't believe that you're as intelligent, capable, qualified or talented as other people, believe you to be despite clear evidence of your ability, your accomplishments and your success, which I think Tanya, you led that off beautifully.

And those of us who experience imposter syndrome because we can't quite connect or internalize our success properly. We are plagued by that feeling that we're going to be found out or exposed as an intellectual fake phony or fraud. And that's really the hallmark of imposter syndrome and what makes it different from standard self doubt. So, the quick thing I'll say is if you experience imposter syndrome. You will absolutely doubt yourself, but you can experience self doubt and it not be imposter syndrome.

And I know we're going to show on that today. So I'm thrilled to be here in my previous life before moving into coaching and speaking full time, I was a technology leader. So I'm very passionate about empowering women in the technology uh sectors globally. So, thank you for having me. Thrilled to be on the panel and um that's where I live that at the moment to invite uh Vena or Gabby into their definition as well.

Thank you. Um OK, I'll go next. So hi, everyone. Thanks for having me and excited to be one of the panelists alongside other inspiring women. So I'm Mina and I'm actually a success and mindset coach, uh founder and managing director of my own coaching and consulting business.

So my goal is to overcome, have help women overcome limiting beliefs and empower them to become the best possible version of themselves through personal career and leadership development. So before this, I was also in the technology field like Alison and I was passionate about empowering women in the tech sector as well as I was in the analytics field. So prior to this, um I love the digital marketing aspect, but I felt like this was also a passion of mine to help people overcome imposter syndrome and reach their full potential, which allowed me to be an entrepreneur. So for me imposter syndrome is similar um to what Alison said, but mine is more a definition of coming from my experiences where when you don't feel like you're good enough that I know all of us have this, that you have to be perfect to achieve a certain standard. And when you're not, you don't feel like you're worthy of love and recognition. But despite knowing that you are actually accepted in love for the way you are and you're actually have the competency and the capability of achieving greatness no matter what anyone says. And I think it's similar whether it's a personal or the tech induced professionally. Um I think that's what impo syndrome could be my own definition of. Yeah, we great.

Thank you so much. My name is Gabby Caballero and um I am the lead Sales Force Enablement program manager for a company called UK G. Um I've been in Sales Force Ecosystem since about 2008. Um Previously, I came from a non tech um background. Um and I'm happy to be part of the panel today with these wonderful ladies. Um So my personal definition is very similar to what the, what everyone else has already said. It is a feeling of doubting yourself of um second guessing, looking over your shoulder and just feeling lucky or, oh, I, I'm lucky that I got this recognition. I'm I, but you know, really I'm not, I earned it and I do deserve it. So, but how do you convince yourself of that?

So that's

kind of we'll be talking about today.

So I think, um you know, both our definitions, um you know, all of our definitions really um seems to have resonated with people and one of the um people on uh you know, uh in this uh room, virtual room had asked this really, um you know, tongue in cheek question but kind of pertinent to what we are discussing.

They said, who isn't an expert? I think this was in relation to when Alison said she was an imposter syndrome expert, right? There's a playoff of the words of on imposter syndrome expert. It feels some days we feel like we are so good at it. We can, we can feel like an impostor in any way, in any shape, irrespective of all the data points, we can see that quantitatively us to have the skills um the, you know, the experience, um the references, anything, all of those data points of success, right? Uh Yet we are able to convince ourselves otherwise we quote unquote experts in uh feeling like an impostor. So I would love for us to kind of, you know, talk about some of those um experiences where we felt like this. But now because it's in the rearview mirror, you um can look back and either, you know, if you were great on that in that moment and you were able to like tackle it we would love to hear about that or if we were not able to tackle it. But now looking back you're like, you know, if I could go back in time, I would tell myself this or I would do this thing. So I would love to hear some examples, um, of, um, experiences of that sort for a while with you.

Mhm. Ok.

Well, I can kick off, um, on that one. So, for me, I didn't escape imposter syndrome. So it's something that plagued me throughout my previous career as a technology executive. Uh but it was a major bout of imposter syndrome back 2013, that really changed the course of my life. And I don't mean that to sound dramatic, but, but this is literally the twist that happened in me to where I am today. So uh I experienced a severe panic attack which was brought upon by my own imposter syndrome in my office in Sydney. Now, don't be alarmed if you're listening to this because not everybody who experiences imposter syndrome has panic attacks. But this is my story and it was after this third major bout and panic attack in my career that I realized that something was wrong and that how I had been feeling. And at the time I was self sabotaging through perfectionist tendencies. They were driving my anxiety through the roof and that's ultimately what led to this panic attack. So it was at that time that I went away and thought to myself, you know, what is actually going on, what is happening to me, I don't want to go through my career with this.

And that's what led me to discover that what I'd been experiencing had a name and that name was imposter syndrome. And it had been researched and investigated for nearly 40 years at the time. So fast forward, nine years here I am now helping people, individuals and companies around the world deal with imposter syndrome, making sure that it's not something that remains debilitating for individuals and making sure that organizations can become more equitable, diverse and inclusive and that we can also remove some of those what we call environmental triggers, which can bring out imposter feelings in the workplace predominantly, but also in your personal life as well.

So the takeaway there is I didn't escape imposter syndrome. It was a major bout of it that caused me to want to explore what it was that led me to working with coaches and the right support networks to overcome it myself. And now I educate and help others do the same around the world. Um And again, just to highlight it makes us self sabotage in many ways. My key self sabotage was perfection, perfectionism. Um I'm sure many of you will resonate with that. It's quite a common one and that caused me all sorts of problems, mentally, physically and emotionally. So it's not a life sentence. You can overcome imposter syndrome as long as you know how it's not something you have to live with and it's absolutely something we can all move past. So that's just a little bit about my story in the time that we have today. I don't want to take more air time from the other speakers. Um So I'll hand over um Gabby or Vina Tanya back to you. But um that's just something I want to share with you all

today. Yeah, you can go. OK. Sure. Um Yeah, similar as to Alison said for me, imposter syndrome. Like um like everyone said, I think it's not something that you completely get rid of. It's always people are going to have it at any time in your life. Um Early career personal, it's about how you handle a situation, how you overcome it and take action. And first me, I experienced one posture syndrome more in my personal life than my career. So ever since I was young, it impacted me as I was raised in a more conservative household. So I was already in a toxic environment. Um So my upbringing was always like my parents were always strict perfectionist. They would always, I always be compared to everyone else. Like I'd be criticized. I would judge it would be, they would be mocking me all the time. Um And being like from an immigrant family, like we came here in the nineties, I had dual like, you know, identities where I was like half Indian and half um you know, like the Western society and I kind of kept getting judgments that I was this girl and have what it takes. And there's a lot of like gender stereotypes. And also because of my mom's upbringing, like she told me not to like, you know, talk back or, you know, raise my boy, always be submissive and gentle.

So because of this, like, I always hesitated to voice my opinions as like a girl. Like I was always scared, there's always this ongoing battle and I had so much of self doubt. But then I realized like over time that I don't know why I was like this because I have so much potential. I have these gifts and talents that I had and then that kind of spilled over to my career. So in my career, I had like 23 career transitions. I wasn't in tech. In the beginning, I was actually a pre med student. I went in from pre-med into econ and then into tech and now an entrepreneur. So it's all so much, it wasn't like a linear path for me. Um I'd always lose my confidence, especially when applying for jobs because everyone was like better than me or had more experience. I was a little bit, I got rejected from top tech companies failed in interviews. But then I realized like, I'm not sure why I was like, struggling. Like I had these, this potential, this capabilities. I was competent though, like I knew that on my own. And I realized I was hiding parts of who I was in my personal journey and my professional journey and I started to self reflect. So I went on a self discovery journey for six years which changed my life.

Um I learned how to like overcome imposter syndrome over time. Um working on like figuring out like journaling basically, like, what are my strengths? Who I, I really like, what gifts do I have? What value can I offer to the world? And based on that, like, I really improve my self confidence and I was able to reach my full potential. So when I learned how to combat imposter syndrome as a coach now, like I feel happy that I can, like Alison said, educate the rest of the people, especially women because I like someone asked me, yes, women actually do um have imposter syndrome more than men. I think it's just in us and I think it's our job to have that support system. And I as a coach, I think it's my, I feel happy when I help other people. Like, because I know what it feels like that I was in that same position. So it's nice to educate that now.

That's great. Um Yeah, similar to Allison and, and Vienna. For me, it started, I mean, I remember mostly feeling it when I started looking into transitioning into tech. Um So I remember sitting in rooms, I was an executive assistant at the time and I supported our Chief digital Officer sitting in the room. And I would um you know, look at some of these people that were experts in their field. And I was like, well, why can't I do this, you know, um why can't I have a job like that? And then I just started questioning myself and I'm like, I can do that. I am good enough to do that. Like, why, how am I different from these people, these like, you know, top earners or whatever? So I started like, um reaching out to people doing my research. Um and I kind of just started overcoming my fears and getting my feet wet and stepping forward and every time I step forward, positive things would happen. And so it was like, oh, so I do need to speak up, I do need to let people know, hey, I'm here. This is what, what I can do. Um I grew up in a family, um my parents were immigrants from Latin America.

Um So I grew up with that mentality that I assimilated from my parents, that you just put your head down and you work hard and you're just grateful, you know, to have a job. But um I didn't realize for many years that I was doing myself a disservice by not speaking up by not asking for what I wanted, I remember accepting jobs where I was doing twice the work and getting paid, half of what other people were being paid. And I did that for many years and I don't do that anymore,

which is great to hear. And um if I can just add something quickly on to that as well, Tanya, because the great shares from Vina and Gabby there and something that I realized then that I didn't share is that imposter syndrome stems from a deeply rooted limiting belief that is often planted in our childhood or adolescent years.

And we can see that through our own stories. And for me, just quickly, it was actually my own mother and the way that she raised me and the fact that she had actually abandoned me as a child that went on later in life to manifest into my own imposter syndrome. So a lot of us can stem can trace back. I beg your pardon the root cause or what I call the seed of what comes out later in life as imposter syndrome predominantly to our childhood or adolescent years that this can be messaging from parents or caregivers or people that were around us or something in the environment or race or culture or religion.

And a lot of things we've already touched on. And I can see some of the questions coming up in the panel here is that yes, all of us, if we experience imposter syndrome have an origin story, which is a time in our past where we were made to feel less then. So, imposter syndrome is not our fault. But if it comes out later in life, as you can see by all of us, even on this panel, there is an element of self work that we need to do as well as certainly address the environmental conditions or triggers that might be there. So it's a little bit from both sides that helps us really carve a path through it. So I just wanted to touch on that as well. So thank you Tanya for that extra time.

Absolutely. Now, this is a time for us to share stories and experiences and um because as we are seeing in the chat, there is just like, certainly resonating what we are bringing up. Um So as you said, you know, imposter syndrome, um so can have its roots pretty early in our lives and um you know, early experiences which could be familiar familial early experiences. Um And you have all touched on, you know, decision points that made you realize what you're experiencing, detrimental effects and how can you overcome it? And that certainly is the work that um you know, some of the work that we have to do. Um But I think that there is also um a shared responsibility between us and our workplaces often. Um you know, this syndrome at it tends to manifest itself most in the context of um our professional lives or our educational lives, basically, whenever we are in surroundings, um where we, there is a question of being judged me and measured, right? Um So I think it would be great to hear your thoughts. As you have both experience, it identified, it worked on yourselves, um brought around you the resources that you used your yourself and also now shared with other people um on things that you can do.

I would love to hear your thought. And Alison given your work with companies as to what is the responsibility of our

workplaces

to create environments where more people that work for them are thriving? I think um you had in our pre conversation shared the statistic that 60 or 70% of people in any workplace experience imposter syndrome. That means that in any meeting in any team, any conversation that we are having, um you know, basically mo majority of the people are wondering if they are good enough to be part of that conversation, they are good enough to do the work and think of all the emotional and mental energy that goes into overcoming that, that couldn't be put to use and actually getting that work done.

So it is actually um you know, in a sense um detrimental for our workplaces for our educational institutions to not create the scaffolding that helps the individuals that populate those spaces, their imposter syndrome. So, um you know, what, what are some things that um you know, these organizations that we are part of where we work and where we learn can do to create more edifying

cultures.

Yes. Yeah, great question. Um Tanya, thank you. And, and I'll kick off with that. So, from an organizational standpoint, there are absolutely things that organizations should be doing, starting with providing logically safe environments for their employees to be authentically themselves, to ask questions, to express, you know, what they're feeling or what they're experiencing and feel safe.

Because if we can work within those environments, firstly, we're more likely to speak up regardless of our background or our condition because we feel safe. So I'm just gonna put that out there. First of all, also. Secondly, from that, it's normalizing the conversation around your imposter syndrome.

So global statistics still suggest around 70% of individuals, not just women but individuals, but right now, I focus on women experience imposter syndrome. So to your point, when we're sitting in meetings, when we're liaising with people on the floor of our building, a lot of us are experiencing imposter syndrome. So normalize the conversation internally. And I don't mean in a confessional way or behind closed doors, I mean, leaders speaking up about imposter syndrome and and other fears and doubt creating environments where people can be their authentic selves and they're more likely to speak up and for leaders ensuring that there is an inclusive environment.

So does everybody get a chance to speak up, you know, is there diversity in equity and inclusion in the leadership or the boards of organizations? Because I think we all know that representation matters, right. It's much easier to become what we can see and much harder if we can't see it. So those things are true. And if you can foster cultures like that, then even if somebody's experiencing imposter syndrome, they're going to speak up about it faster. Or as um Gabby touched on perfectly, they might identify it in themselves faster and then start challenging themselves in a good way, start taking action and start moving through it. So there's a beautiful sort of domino effect when we create environments and cultures like that.

Because if you have, if you work within a toxic culture or an environment that is triggering to imposter syndrome, then you as the person experiencing it are going to be experiencing higher effects of it. So if we keep walking in to a toxic environment and that fear then keeps being triggered, it's going to impact on us more. So environment plays a crucial role and across just quickly on the personal side before I hand over to Vina. Um and Gabby is that you yourself, if you're experiencing imposter syndrome and this is a great forum for it, finding a network or somebody, even just one person that you trust and that you can speak to about it because although 70% of us experience it, experience it by its very nature.

We feel shame and we feel guilt internally, these powerful feelings associated with imposter syndrome. So we don't share. We think we're the only ones sitting in the room experiencing it. We think we're the only ones that is feeling not good enough. So find someone you trust could be, one person could be a wonderful network like we're in right now and speak about it because you can't battle imposter syndrome in your own head. Your negative thoughts are very powerful. We have to verbalize and we have to move to taking action, which I think both that both all of all of us so far have touched on as well. So um very, very important. So that's, you know, from a high level and they're gonna wanna get gabby and, and Vina in here as well with their wonderful um experience as well, but they're just some of the takeaways I'll share and, and Tonya happy to look back to that throughout the chat

as well. Um I'm gonna just agree exactly to what Alison said 100%. Like I, when I apply for jobs or like a work companies, the first thing I ask about is the environment and the culture. And for me, like the first thing I say is like I look at if they have like that growth mindset where I'm growing and evolving and I think that's important because I don't want an environment where I'm just like, ok, I'm not doing well and immediately I'm fired. You know, there is, I think like that one person said, I think, I don't know who it was on the chat. That's about like facing your fears. You have to come out of your comfort zone. That's one way to overcome and foster syndrome. At first, it is definitely difficult. I'm not saying it isn't, but like Alison said, you need to have a network. The first thing I would say is have a very good sisterhood or a network full of people that you trust and who you can talk to. So women tech network for me and when I was first getting into tech, like two years ago, I had no idea because I was coming from a non tech background and I was like, I don't know what skills I'm doing. I don't know what coding is. Like I had no idea. And when I entered woman tech network, it made a huge difference for me. I was able to talk to every one of these people. I had mentors who helped me. Like I was sitting here like I literally told them right?

I had imposter syndrome. You know, I'm not, I don't think I'm good enough like I was very behind compared to my peers. When it comes to experience, I was applying for a senior level position, which I did get like last year. But when applying for it, I was like, should I even apply for this? Like, am I actually good enough? Like I always have that in me. And I was like, why am I like this? Like I, I can have value. I have competency. I have one of those skills. I have a passion. Um I went for it but I, at the same time, I was like getting advice from mentors. So I think that's very important, like Alison said, um and going out of your comfort zone, if there's nothing wrong, like I, I actually attacked the senior level position that I wasn't, felt like I wasn't good enough, but maybe it wasn't the exact right role for me. But I learned a lot like I grew so much in my role. Like I tackled things that I wouldn't have never tackled if I didn't have imposter syndrome. Like I would have just stayed like learning about the same things over and over again that doesn't help you grow or evolve. So I actually think that role, like I was like, maybe it's not the perfect role for me, but I knew what I was doing.

I learned so much within a span of like couple of months to a few years and I think that's the first step. So um definitely get the support you need. Ok. Yeah,

I agree 100% with what Alison and Vena said. And for me, it's important too when I'm looking for employers now that you know, D EIB now, which is belonging are, you know, that that's really tied into their core values and um sales force for me. Like I'm, I don't work directly for sales force but being part of the sales force, Ohana, I found that I've never found a group of people, I've never experienced anything like it. And um, I have several of my Ohana members here that in the chat actively today supporting but you know, finding a group of people that support you and have your back and um you know, that can be in your corner when you need them to, that, that is so essential and finding a great mentor that you can talk to about these things.

Um I think is also a good way to go.

Yes, community and mentors, right? I think this was um you know, some of the things that you brought up um the importance of community coworkers, mentors um in helping us overcome that imposter syndrome and some stories are so inspiring. Um I would love for um you know, you to share, how did you, for those of you that said, you know, you found an amazing mentor or you or mentors who inspired you like Vina, you said that um you know, I would love or, you know, Allison or Gabby, as you um were there were there people specific people spec in specific situations that you're willing to share that helped you reset your mindset to, um, you know, kind of see the fraud, that imposter syndrome is not you.

But, but this feeling is that's not, that's the thing that's not true. Um So, you know, how did you, how did you recognize it? And what was the role that a friend, a mentor and ally played in helping you identify it? So, oh,

sorry,

please. I think from my perspective when I had that huge panic attack, I was talking about back in 2013, I literally went on the hunt looking for information and that, you know, I, I literally went to Google and, and, and went on a hunt for information which led me to learning about imposter syndrome and self identifying with that.

And then I discovered the work of Dr Valerie Young, who's the global leading expert on imposter syndrome and spent a lot of time with Dr Young's work and global research and all of those sorts of things. So then for me, I was able to self identify and essentially self diagnose accurately that I was experiencing imposter syndrome. I went and sought a career coach at the time just by getting referrals and recommendations. And I also um was very fortunate at the time to have both male and female leaders that I worked with that provided psychological safe spaces where I could share what I was experiencing and get that type of mentorship or support we've been talking about. Um, of course, as a coach Now, I'm an advocate of coaching. I'm an advocate of mentoring because network and support what is important. And if you have the financial resources and the desire to invest in a coach or a program, then by all means, I encourage it. However, there is wonderful mentoring sponsorships and networks. You can be a part of that don't cost any money and just involve you obviously investing your time and sharing your learning. So find what suits you. The takeaway from me is, please just know that help is out there.

There are a lot of options. You're not alone in experiencing imposter syndrome. And if you can surround yourself with the right people, whether it's one or two or 10 or an entire network, it's going to help you be able to move through it faster. So you don't need to do this on your own is, is my takeaway and still to this day, I maintain my own mentors, my own coaches, you know, both across Australia and globally. So I still invest every day in making myself better at what I do, um from a professional standpoint and a personal standpoint. So we're always growing, you know, we're always looking to get better and we're always looking to find solutions and that's a great mindset to be in because imposter syndrome wants to keep you stuck, it wants to silence you, it wants you to move back. It's fear, right? And fear will hold us back if we don't take action and push through it as the other ladies have, have perfectly shared today as well. So that's just a little bit about my story. Um But definitely find the support, find the safe environment. Please find people that you trust is the final thing I'll say, speaking to the wrong person or investing in the wrong network can be detrimental.

Make sure you feel safe, make sure you trust the person regardless of who they are, what gender or where they're located,

good

advice, you know, stories of people, uh individuals and um times when their support in their listening ear, maybe their advice has just been crucial to you in identifying and overcoming your imposter syndrome in the, in the moment.

Yeah. So for me, um like I said, it was like applying for jobs in tech um as a data analyst, there's a lot of competition out there. And for every interview, I was just like always nervous about everything. But I, like Alison said, um I kind of found the right networks, but I did a lot of research on linkedin. I think linkedin is like my go to like my lifesaver, I found a lot of career coaches before I became a career coach now. Like I'm my own career coach. So I did some work on myself, but I also went on linkedin and found amazing, like people that I felt inspired by you kind of just kept posting like blog posts and I'd read them in detail, like learn the strategies over time. I even did a phone call. So what I say, like advice is please reach out to them. They're super nice. Like for me, like I had that problem where yes, as ambitious women, we struggle to ask for help. And I think that's in all ages and I realized I used to never ask for help. I was like, I can do this on my own. I can do this on my own. I was like kind of shy to, to do that. But when I realized, I think that one like actually asking for help isn't the best thing I did.

And I reached out to people who actually inspired me and who sat down and be like, OK, so these are the skills you need, this is your strength, is your weakness. What do you need to focus on? And at that time, I was like, this is very helpful for me because now, like, I felt like I was kind of like an impostor, right? So um they asked like, they kind of talked to me, I felt safe, like I could express my feelings. And I also not only woman tech network, woman, tech network took me places actually doing. I was a global ambassador. I won the global ambassador award for 2020. Um I got my leadership skills like also not only in tech but for leadership, like I said before, I never thought I had the leadership skills to become an effective leader. And um in tech, I was always like, you know, like I can't do this. I'm, I'm not good enough. I can't speak up. I was a very shy person until you see me right now. But um Anna, because of woman tech and the leadership skills, I doubt because of her. And from that onwards, I did like, attend, I did join a nonprofit. It's a South Asian nonprofit. So people who are like minded people who are like me and it's called me three. And I was just like stunned by these people, these people are tech leaders and I, they were like in the same boat as I was.

And even though like I'm like in my early career, these people are late careers and they're all like saying the same thing, they were all relatable. And I think that part was the authenticity, like they're all authentic and vulnerable. And I was like, if they can do it, like, I feel like I can have a space, space to be vulnerable and talk about my feelings. And I think like Alison said, like the network, the support system that you have is super important. So seek the right people. If you don't know it, you know, we're here to help you. So like Alison and I are coaches ourselves. I'm a career coach. I'm here to help some personal life and professionally. I've helped clients with imposter syndrome. So we're here, Alison Gabby is here. Even Tanya um has touched upon this. Um but we're here to give you resources and the help that you need. I think that's the first step to take. Ok, Gaby, for me, I've talked a lot

about the sales force, Ohana and the power of the Ohana. And actually my mentor and coach is here aka Sharma. I can see him in the chat. So thanks for coming coach to support. But he was, he's been very instrumental in kind of helping me to come out of my shell. I remember during one of our first conversations, he was like, but why can't you everything, you know, I was like, so scared. I was so um you know, cautious, I was like, oh, but I don't know if I can and he was like, why can't you, of course you can. And even today, um he, you know, he's the one that encouraged me to, to, you know, apply to um to be on the panel or to be, you know, a speaker and he's always encouraging me and pushing me out of my comfort zone when, when I don't have the strength to push myself out of my comfort zone, which is good.

So it's good to find people like that that have your back um an ally um surround yourself with other women in tech that are going through similar experiences. I have met so many wonderful people through linkedin as well. Um through the power of the community of the sales force community, going to all the events, people that have just been like so instrumental in me um kind of shaping who I am now. And um so I'm grateful to them and I'm always trying to give back. I, I'm not a career coach but I do. Um I do, you know, I, I am a mentor. I do now, I'm mentoring people in return. So it's also like giving back to the community, right? So people help you. So reach, you know, it's kind of like the image of you reaching back down and helping the next person um to come up

a great, a great and can I just give Gabby a touch on that very quick brief frame, Tanya, I'm, I'm watching the clock as well is um you said something there, you know, when you're saying, oh, who am I, you know, to do this or that sort of thing? And when we have imposter syndrome, we're very quick to say, you know, who am I to do that? But a really quick reframe for all of you is who are you not to do it? You know, what, what would you do or what is possible if fear wasn't holding you back and immediately flip that question to, well, who am I not to do this? You know, why should I not try and really challenge those negative thoughts or that little inner critic voice when it comes up because the faster we can reframe that and Gabby, I love that you share that your mentor who's on the line helped you do that, the faster we can come to challenging that immediate first negative voice and say, well, who am I not?

Why shouldn't I do this changing the language is just a very quick tip for you all as well, which is what we call reframing is very, very powerful. So catch the negative as fast as you can. And if you can learn to challenge it really quickly, it shifts your entire perspective and um and mindset which I know Vina, you know, touched on as well earlier today. So just a quick share gabby because I think you just kind of nailed it in what you were saying. What a great example.

Well, thank you, Alison uh for adding to uh what I have now put together a big list of really awesome bits of advice that you have shared all have shared over the last 45 minutes. So I'm going to um you know, read this out and I hope um you know, one of my awesome panelists can start typing it in, but here is, here are some ways in which we can all overcome imposter syndrome, finding a coach or a mentor, reaching out to a trusted network of people asking for help.

And I would say that three times, asking for help, asking for help, asking for help being authentic and vulnerable, but to the right person or persons irrespective of gender race location. If these are people, you trust be authentic and vulnerable with them, find people who push you to take the next step forward when you can push yourself and last very well put by Alison, who are you not to take the next step forward? So these have been fantastic actionable pieces of advice. Um Thank you ladies for being here with me. I I don't even know how 15, you know, 40 something minutes.

This was

such good conversation so much guys. Thank you, everyone who has been so active on chat. Um So let's all raise our hands to take the next step forward while lending a hand to our greater community of women, of people, of allies who are all around us. Thank

you. Thank you. Lovely to see you. Thank you.

Bye bye. Thank you.